RHOBLOGY: The Holy Spirit revealed to me that the KJV is perfect

Wednesday, February 26, 2014

The Holy Spirit revealed to me that the KJV is perfect

People need to realise that there's more to KJV-Only fanaticism than just thinking the KJV is the best Bible. Usually it entails serious sin and slander on the part of its adherents. Those who do so need to repent of their sin.

Irrational KJV Lover (IKL) shared a photo.

· · Share · 18 hours ago ·

Me Who claims we need Greek to understand the Bible? Yet in certain cases, studying Greek (and Hebrew) helps.
And it's a category error to say that one can't complain the KJV is hard to understand vs understanding Greek. Virtually everyone uses the English Bible to read, like on a daily basis. And much of the outdated language in the KJV just plain gets in the way of comprehension. It's not even a question, and you know it's the case. But you won't admit it b/c you have this weird idea that the KJV is perfect and breathed out by God or something.

18 hours ago ·
IKL For you to deny Gods perfect word Rho is to deny Christ. The bible is perfect and yes was breathed out by God in the same way he breathed out the Ark. No intellectual can understand how Noah with only his sons built the great boat and brought on all the animals etc..but we know he can do anything...it was a small thing for him to give us the bible in English although he used men who were burned to death to get it in our hands. He gave moses the ten commandments etched into stone.. Do you seriously think that God could not give us his perfect word? Todays Greek aint the same as the greek text. You try to hard my friend God makes things simple and he does all things orderly and does not work in confusion. Only satan would have us doubt scripture.

18 hours ago ·
Me Nah brother, I'm not denying God's perfect word. Just reminding you that the KJV isn't perfect. It's great, awesome, wonderful. It has a few small problems, that's it.

\\it was a small thing for him to give us the bible in English\\

Of course, but that doesn't mean that the KJV came straight from God or that it is perfect. It's not perfect. It's great, awesome, wonderful. It has a few small problems, that's it.

If you're looking for the perfect one, you need the Greek autographa. We don't have those at the moment, that we know of, but thank God He has preserved His word to an extremely high degree, that we can be confident that we can know what He has said.

\\Do you seriously think that God could not give us his perfect word?\\

Why even ask that question? Of course He CAN; He's omnipotent.

\\Todays Greek aint the same as the greek text. \\

Of course. Still less is the KJV the original Greek text.

\\Only satan would have us doubt scripture.\\

Then why are you doubting that, say, the NASB and ESV faithfully give us God's Word? You condemn your own position.

17 hours ago ·
IKL All I had to hear you say was Gods word is not perfect to know where you stand Rho.

17 hours ago ·
IKL The KJB is honest when there is a word that cannot be translated exactly it is italicized..there is no copy right on Gods word either unlike the books that claim to be Gods word.

17 hours ago ·
IKL You have fallen into intellectual reasoning and wont or cant see That God gave the english speaking people his perfect word. God is the same and never changes, Jesus is the word made flesh. As I am sure you know, Do you claim that God would want his children reading several alternate versions of his word? (Seeking several alternatives to his son?) Where will it end? There is another version coming out all the time.
You do not have to hold a masters to understand Gods word.
There is only one Jesus and there is only one bible they are inseparable. We have had it in English for over 400 years. The number one book of all time. The KIng James Bible.

17 hours ago ·
IKL

17 hours ago ·
Me \\ All I had to hear you say was Gods word is not perfect to know where you stand Rho.\\

I didn't say that. I said the *KJV* is not perfect. Because it is a translation and its translators did a great job but had a few pieces of mistaken information, like the Comma Johanneum.
You know who twists words, according to Scripture? The devil. Don't be like him, brother.

I don't agree AT ALL that I said God's Word isn't perfect. But I don't agree that the KJV is God's original Word, or that He preserved it 100% or breathed it out itself. He breathed out the Greek originals. The KJV is God's Word insofar that it accurately reflects those, and it does in almost all cases. Just not EVERY single case, and not superior to, say, the NASB.

\\The KJB is honest when there is a word that cannot be translated exactly it is italicized\\

1) The NASB does that too, but you think the NASB is from the devil. Be consistent, brother.
2) Just b/c the KJV is honest with its italics is not an argument for its direct inspiration by God. You know that, right?

\\wont or cant see That God gave the english speaking people his perfect word.\\

What is your evidence for this assertion?

\\Do you claim that God would want his children reading several alternate versions of his word? \\

Since His children DO read several alternate versions (ie, translations) of His Word, and He works all things after the counsel of His will and He works all things together for the good of those who love Him and who are called according to His purpose, it would appear He DOES want that.
And what's the problem with the other versions? They all have their own problems, some big (like the New Living "Translation", which is horrible), some small (like the NASB or the KJV).
But see, YOU say that the others are FROM THE DEVIL. You need to prove that.

\\Seeking several alternatives to his son?\\

Category error, confusing Jesus with the Bible. They are not the same thing.

\\There is another version coming out all the time. \\

I know, and I don't like that, but that is not an argument for either
1) the KJV is perfect
2) other good versions like NASB are of the devil.

\\There is only one Jesus and there is only one bible they are inseparable. We have had it in English for over 400 years.\\

401 years ago, nobody had a perfect word from God, then.

As for that ridiculous poster:
Of course none of the originals exist. That's why the science of textual criticism exists.
If the originals had been collated together in one book, someone could have seized them and controlled their distribution. You're criticising the way God handled the preservation of His Word, and that's never wise. I would repent of that, if I were you.
I'd wager an approximately equal number of people read Greek well enough to understand the Greek NT as can readily understand the KJV with some its entirely outdated renderings.
Of course God preserved His Word. How does it follow that He BREATHED OUT A PERFECT ENGLISH TRANSLATION, though? Where's the argument?

9 hours ago ·
IKL

6 hours ago ·
IKL Dr Logsdon a member of the committee who translated the NASB said of the NASB and all others and I Quote

If you hold the Authorized Version, and someone tries to prod you to accept another, "You don't need to defend it; you don't need to apologize for it.

"Just say, 'Well, did this new version or this translation come down through the Roman Catholic stream? If so, count me out.'"

6 hours ago · Edited ·
IKL Dr. Frank Logsdon, member of the translation committee for the New American Standard Version (NASB), has denounced his work on that Bible and urged all Christians to return to the Authorized Version, commonly known as the King James Bible.

6 hours ago ·
IKL Although the most popular translation at the present time is the New International Version, both of these modern Bibles are based upon the same Catholic text, and Logsdon's concerns apply to both.

6 hours ago ·
IKL Being involved with the project from the very beginning, Logsdon helped publisher F. Dewey Lockman with the feasibility study that led to the translation. He interviewed some of the translators, sat with them, and even wrote the preface. But soon the questions began coming in.

His old friend, Dr. David Otis Fuller, began to put his finger on the many shortcomings of the Catholic text used in all modern Bibles, which include the NASB and today's NIV.

Logsdon finally said, "I'm in trouble; I can't refute these arguments; it's wrong; it's terribly wrong; it's frightfully wrong; and what am I going to do about it?"

6 hours ago ·
IKL Logsdon shocked publisher Dewey Lockman by writing, "I must under God renounce every attachment to the New American Standard."

Logsdon then began to travel extensively, trying to make up for his error by explaining to people the very simple reasons why the Authorized Version is the one Bible which is absolutely 100% correct.

6 hours ago ·
Me \\Dr Logsdon a member of the committee who translated the NASB said of the NASB and all others and I Quote \\

So what?
Tons of people worked on NASB and tons since have examined it carefully.

The KJV was the Bible of the Anglican church, which thinks that Rome is a real church, has archbishops, allowed kings to annul marriages that had already included sexual relations, went painfully liberal, and persecuted men like Wesley. I guess the KJV should be rejected, by your reasoning.

\\Dr. Frank Logsdon, member of the translation committee for the New American Standard Version (NASB), has denounced his work on that Bible and urged all Christians to return to the Authorized Version, commonly known as the King James Bible.\\

So what? Give me a reason to think that matters.

\\both of these modern Bibles are based upon the same Catholic text, and Logsdon's concerns apply to both.\\

So what? The KJV was done by Anglicans.
Maybe we should use the CSB instead, since it was a Southern Baptist work in its entirety.
I guess the CSB is a perfect text, right? Since it was done by Baptists? Right?

\\Logsdon finally said, "I'm in trouble; I can't refute these arguments; it's wrong; it's terribly wrong; it's frightfully wrong; and what am I going to do about it?"\\

His lack of knowledge about how stupid your arguments are doesn't make your arguments any less stupid.

DID YOU KNOW?
The KJV has 64,000 unnecessary words!
It accepts a since-refuted textual variant in Isaiah 14!
It messes up the doctrine of eternal punishment by improperly translating the pre-Eschaton abode of the dead as "hell", rather than "Sheol", which is what it should be!
It puts God's name where it should not be!
It waters down the meaning of "repent" by using it too much, where it doesn't belong!
It adds to the text what God did not write, such as 1 John 5:8!
In the New Testament alone, the KJV has 2289 unnecessary words!!!!!!!!!!!!111

6 hours ago ·
IKL Along with many other scholars, Logsdon had blindly accepted the basic argument used today to support the use of the two Catholic manuscripts, the Vaticanus and the Sinaiticus, in all modern Bibles.

6 hours ago ·
IKL \\many other Scholars agreed.

6 hours ago ·
Me It is an anachronistic and ignorant thing to say that Vaticanus and Sinaiticus are "Catholic", by which you no doubt mean ROMAN Catholic. The Roman Church as we know it today did not exist in the 4th century. Not even close. You're ignorant of history, IKL.

6 hours ago ·
IKL You are a closet catholic

6 hours ago ·
Me And many other scholars DISagree!
And many scholars say that the KJV has problems!
so are you going to repent of saying that the other Bibles are from the devil?

\\You are a closet catholic\\

That's utterly stupid.

6 hours ago ·
IKL The "experts" claim that these are the oldest manuscripts in existence, so they must be the best!

In one of his many public speeches, Logsdon explained, "When there is an omission that might be observed, they put in the margin, 'Not in the oldest manuscripts.' But they don't tell you what those oldest manuscripts are. What oldest manuscripts?

Or they say, 'Not in the best manuscripts.' What are the best manuscripts? They don't tell you. You see how subtle that is?

The average man sees a little note in the margin which says 'not in the better manuscripts' and he takes for granted they are scholars and they must know, and then he goes on. That's how easily one can be deceived."

6 hours ago ·
Me \\The "experts" claim that these are the oldest manuscripts in existence, so they must be the best!\\

That is false. They are not the oldest. And no one claims they are the best. they take ALL the MSS into consideration for modern Bibles like NASB.

\\What oldest manuscripts?\\

MSS that are older than the ones that are not old. Duh, IKL. Come on now. Think.

\\The average man sees a little note in the margin which says 'not in the better manuscripts' \\

the average man reads the KJV and has NO IDEA what it just said. So what? Be consistent, IKL.

He can read a word in the KJV that means the OPPOSITE today of what it meant back then. That's how easily one can be deceived. We should reject the KJV, right?

5 hours ago ·
IKL It was only after Logsdon took the time to really look into this issue that he was horrified to see that he had played right into Satan's hands, and helped to take many verses out of the Scriptures. Logsdon admitted, "The deletions are absolutely frightening."

The huge number of English Bible translations currently available has produced untold millions of dollars in sales, but does anyone believe that they have produced a modern Church which is more knowledgeable about their Bible? No, it has produced the Siamese twins of confusion and falling away from truth.

5 hours ago ·
IKL All modern Bible translators today use, without question, the New Testament text produced by the famous scholars Hort and Westcott.

But in her book, New Age Bible Versions, author Gail Riplinger exposes the background and corrupt theology of these giants.

Many readers are surprised at the beliefs of these men, documented by their own writings. Yet modern scholars accept their work without question, just as many university professors today blindly accept evolutionary teaching, safely going along with the crowd to protect their reputations. If you hold in your hand the Authorized Version, you have God's Truth.

5 hours ago ·
Me \\"The deletions are absolutely frightening."\\

He is wrong about that. Anyone can examine them in the NA28 apparatus and find what translation and textual decisions were made.

Why should I care what this guy said, again?

\\does anyone believe that they have produced a modern Church which is more knowledgeable about their Bible? No, it has produced the Siamese twins of confusion and falling away from truth.\\

Correlation is not the same as causation.
What is your evidence that the abundance of translations is a CAUSE, rather than an EFFECT, of the church's losing her saltiness?
Reading the KJV didn't keep the Anglican church from becoming a wreck of wretched doctrine. So we should reject the KJV, right?

5 hours ago ·
Me \\the New Testament text produced by the famous scholars Hort and Westcott.\\\

that is false. They use the Nestle-Rhod Novum Taestamentum Graecae, which is now in its 28th edition. W & H are long dead.
You know that, IKL. Why are you saying stupid things?

\\Gail Riplinger exposes the background and corrupt theology of these giants.\\

Gail Riplinger is a documented liar. Even if she weren't, why should I care about W&H's theology?

\\If you hold in your hand the Authorized Version, you have God's Truth.\\

Prove it. You haven't given an argument.

5 hours ago ·
IKL He helped write your favorite bible Rho and he has repented of it. That is why you should listen to him

5 hours ago ·
IKL History supports it, the Holy Spirit has confirmed it, God's Church has prospered by it. You will find it is hated by all those who seek to make an elastic Bible that is all things to all people… which then becomes nothing to anyone.

5 hours ago ·
Me \\He helped write your favorite bible Rho and he has repented of it. That is why you should listen to him\\

Lots of people have done good things and then either apostatised or said stupid things after. When are you goiing to post a real argument?

\\History supports it,\\

Be specific. What do you mean?

\\the Holy Spirit has confirmed it\\

What does that mean?

\\God's Church has prospered by it.\\

Of course, just like the ESV and NASB. I never denied the KJV is fantastic. I deny the others are of the devil, and I'm calling you to repent of your evil speech.

\\You will find it is hated by all those who seek to make an elastic Bible that is all things to all people\\

I invite you to come out preaching with me sometime so you can see how well beloved the NASB is by those who hate Jesus. What a joke.

So....what is your argument? prove the KJV is perfect.

5 hours ago ·
Me Why does the KJV add a whole verse that's not original, in 1 John 5:8? The man who did that got cursed for adding to God's Word, right IKL?

5 hours ago · · 1
IKL Sorry man you really need to throw out your James White books. He has you all twisted.
You are not arguing with me you are arguing with God and his perfect word.

5 hours ago ·
IKL Some may say, "I accept the Bible where it is accurately translated." Fine! THAT is the statement of faith of every Mormon in the world! WHO is to judge just where the Bible is "accurately translated?"

5 hours ago ·
IKL God promises to preserve His words.

The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. (Psalms 12:6-7)

5 hours ago · Edited ·
IKL You shall not add or take away, says God.

Now therefore hearken, O Israel, unto the statutes and unto the judgments, which I teach you, for to do them, that ye may live, and go in and possess the land which the LORD God of your fathers giveth you. Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.
(Deuteronomy 4:1-2)

5 hours ago ·
IKL God cares about every one of His words.

Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. (Proverbs 30:5-6)

5 hours ago ·
IKL God's words will never pass away.

Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away. (Jesus Christ, Son of God) (Mark 13:31)

5 hours ago ·
IKL God will curse those who change His Word.

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. (Revelation 22:18-19)

5 hours ago ·
IKL This doesn't sound like God inspired only the "concepts" in Scripture. He clearly directed every word and will not tolerate man's meddling with it. He calls them "His Words."

If your Bible is a King James Bible, it preserves God's words because it was translated using "formal equivalence." All other Bibles were translated using "dynamic equivalence," in which the translator is free to change words as long as he conveys the "idea."

Read the above Scriptures again. Which kind of Bible do you think God wants you to have?

5 hours ago ·
Me \\you are arguing with God and his perfect word.\\

How do you know that?
Just your blind faith?

I haven't read any of White's books on this topic.
How about you actually answer my questions? And repent of your evil speech about these Bibles and also of James White, whom you wickedly called a servant of the devil.

You appear to love the KJV more than you love Jesus. Prove me wrong.

5 hours ago ·
Me \\Some may say, "I accept the Bible where it is accurately translated." Fine! THAT is the statement of faith of every Mormon in the world!\\

So what? When Mormons say it, they mean that the Book of Mormon is true and the Bible is not. They're as knowledgeable in textual criticism as you are.

\\WHO is to judge just where the Bible is "accurately translated?"\\

It's called "textual criticism". And it's not JUDGING. It's trying to understand what the original Greek text actually said, since there's no evidence that God breathed out the KJV.

\\God promises to preserve His words.\\

And He did. But not in the KJV, b/c the KJV adds verses and gets stuff wrong here and there.

\\You shall not add or take away, says God. \\

And the KJV adds 1 John 5:8. UH OH!!!!!!!1

\\God cares about every one of His words.\\

Already asked and answered, but you are acting like you didn't even read what I said.

\\God's words will never pass away. \\

Doesn't mean what you think it does, since there's no evidence that God breathed out the KJV.

\\God will curse those who change His Word. \\

So God cursed Erasmus for adding 1 John 5:8, RIGHT?
And you shouldn't read what a man like him wrote for the Bible, since you think W&H's influence makes the NASB a work of the devil, RIGHT? Be consistent!

\\If your Bible is a King James Bible, it preserves God's words because it was translated using "formal equivalence."\\

NASB and ESV are also formal equivalence.

\\All other Bibles were translated using "dynamic equivalence,\\

That's false, and you are ignorant.
All translation is to some extent dynamic, so there is a sliding scale, a spectrum. There is no way to go word-for-word in every single case from one language to another. You're ignorant of translation as well.

\\Which kind of Bible do you think God wants you to have?\\

A faithful one.
Where is your evidence that God breathed out the KJV? Where are your answers to my questions and challenges?

5 hours ago ·
IKL Even Peter was controlled by Satan as Jesus told Peter get behind me Satan. Many men have had good intentions thinking in there minds they were doing right.

The translators are the same I am certain many if not most all had very good intentions. The heart is evil continually.

Jesus and his word are the same.

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Wherein We Find That Our Sovereign God Has Kept

His Holy Word Pure And Free From The Vicious

Attempts Of Apostate "Scholars" To Defile

And Destroy It.

5 hours ago ·
IKL Rho The Mormons bible and The watchtower bible will offend as well. I would not use them either.

I am not saying there isnt enough Gospel in your version to get a person saved but we are commanded to live by every word of God and how can we do that as Christians when we do not read every word of God bibles.

4 hours ago ·
IKL There is a book God gave us though ...the King James Bible is perfect. 100% accurate.

4 hours ago ·
IKL The verse you are hyperventilating over Rho is exactly where God placed it in his perfect book.

I John 5:7-8, commonly referred to as the Johannine Comma, has been one of the most hotly debated passages with regard to its authenticity for over a century. Because it is one of those few passages included in the Textus Receptus which has a weak attestation from Greek manuscripts, many a student has paced his study for hours struggling with the question as to whether or not the Comma is a legitimate part of the Holy Scriptures.
The hasty dismissal of this passage in most modern versions of the Bible is largely due to the fact that it is only found in eight of the five hundred Greek manuscripts that witness to the fifth chapter of I John. Consequently, it is almost unanimously regarded among modern textual critics as a later scribal emendation. The primary English translation that contains the Johannine Comma is the Authorized King James Bible which is based upon the Greek Textus Receptus. The passage reads:

4 hours ago ·
IKL 7For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.8And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Most modern translations (NAS, NIV, RSV, NLT, LB et. al.), on the other hand, are based upon the Alexandrian text-type tradition (i.e. Sinaiticus and Vaticanus). These versions commonly read as does the NIV:

7For there are three that testify: 8the spirit, the water, and the blood; and the three are in agreement.

As anyone can clearly see, there is a substantial omission and consequent mix-up of the text. The modern versions arrive at such a rendering by completely removing verse 7, as found in the AV; then, the phrase "in the earth" is excised and the first phrase of verse 8 (There are three that bear witness) becomes verse 7.Thus, the entire arrangement and sense of the passage is altered.

Unfortunately, this altering of the text is often accepted without question. In fact, the issue is rarely, if ever, reasoned through in modern times. Accusations against the passage's authenticity are simply announced as though they were facts. Such conclusions imply that there is no evidence that can be mounted in favor of the Comma's genuineness. This, however, is far from the truth. The purpose of this study is to construct such a case. In doing so, the author will apply ten exegetical tools to the text of I John 5:7-8, gearing them toward the issue of authenticity.

4 hours ago ·
IKL The overall purpose of such exegesis is not to prove genuineness although the author would concede to such a conclusion. Rather, the evidence will show that a case for authenticity deserves a hearing as much, if not more than a case for spuriousness. The issue, in other words, is not settled as most critical commentators would assert; there are no foregone conclusions.

After all, the burden of proof lies with the accuser whose responsibility it is to prove that the text is an emendation. The exegesis that follows will at the very least cast a shadow of doubt on the accusation itself therefore precluding its ability to be proven.[1] May God Almighty guide this quest which seeks, above all, to magnify and establish his perfectly preserved Word.

4 hours ago ·
IKL Historical Analysis

The epistle of I John was probably written late in the first century (ca. 90) from Ephesus by none other than the Apostle John. The intended audience is not exactly clear; however, the lack of personal references suggests that it was written to Christians all across Asia Minor. The same can be said for John's Gospel which was also written from Ephesus in the same general time period (ca. 85-90). It is interesting to note the literary coherence that exists between these two separate New Testament writings.
The well-known Greek scholar, A.T. Robertson, once wrote, "in the whole of the First Epistle [I John] there is hardly a single thought that is not found in the Gospel [John]."[2]This coherence has been considered even more evident than that which exists between Luke and Acts.

Such a fact has led some to believe that I John served as preface or dedicatory epistle to the Gospel of John, for both Books are characterized by repetition, contrast, parallelism, personal elements, profound spirituality, and doctrine.[3]Historically speaking, it is very possible that the Gospel of John was attached to the epistle as it was sent out to the addressees. I John was to be read as an introduction or commentary on the teachings of the Gospel. John Ebrard writes:

4 hours ago ·
IKL It [I John] bears the stamp of a preface or dedicatory epistle. The Apostle addresses himself to specific readers, and holds communion, person to person, with them, in that we mark the essence of the epistle; but he does this on occasion of another communication, to which this is attached, and to which it refers; and therefore, in its form, it is no epistle, no simple and direct substitute of oral speech, but an address uttered on occasion of the reading of another and different communication.[4]
The exhortations contained in I John were uttered by the Apostle on occasion of the contents contained in the Gospel. Having understood the principles of Christians fellowship promulgated in the Epistle, the reader could proceed to understand the entire basis of his fellowship, the life and work of Jesus Christ as promulgated in the Gospel.

Regarding the issue at hand, such a distinct literary/historical coherence fully supports the inclusion of the Johannine Comma. The resounding theme of the Gospel of John is the divinity of Jesus Christ. Such is summed up in John 10:30, when Jesus says, "I and my Father are one." This same theme is prevalent in the Epistle, being concisely and clearly stated in 5:7-8.The Comma truly bears coherence with the message of John's Gospel in this sense. It serves as an occasion to introduce the doctrine of the Trinity as the original readers prepared to study the attached Gospel. Although Christ's divinity is inferred throughout the epistle, one is not confronted with such succinct declaration as is conveyed in the Comma. If this passage is omitted, it seems that the theme of John's Gospel would lack a proper introduction.

It is interesting to note that one of the earliest allusions to the Johannine Comma in church history is promulgated in connection to the thematic statement made by the Lord in John 10:30.[5] Cyprian writes around A.D. 250, "The Lord says 'I and the Father are one' and likewise it is written of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 'And these three are one.'"[6] The theological teaching of the Comma most definitely bears coherence with the overriding theme of John's Gospel. There is no reason to believe that the verse is not genuine in this sense, for it serves as a proper prelude to the theme of the Gospel which, historically speaking, most likely accompanied the Epistle as it was sent out to its original audience.

The heresy of Gnosticism is also of notable importance with regard to the historical context surrounding the Johannine Comma. This "unethical intellectualism" had begun to make inroads among churches in John's day; its influence would continue to grow up until the second century when it gave pure Christianity a giant struggle.[7] Generally speaking, Gnosticism can be described as a variety of syncretic religious movements in the early period of church history that sought to answer the question, "What must I do to be saved?"

The Gnostic answer was that a person must possess a secret knowledge.[8] One of the major tenets of Gnosticism was the essential evil of matter; the physical body, in other words, was viewed as evil. According to this line of thought, Jesus Christ could not have been fully God and fully man, for this would have required him to posses an evil physical body.

The seeds of the Gnostic heresy seem to be before John's mind in his first epistle; nine times he gives tests for knowing truth in conjunction with the verb ginwskw (to know).[9] This being said, the Johannine Comma would have constituted an integral component of the case the Apostle made against the false teachings of the Gnostics, especially with regard to the nature of Christ. Robertson notes that John's Gospel was written to prove the deity of Christ, assuming his humanity, while I John was written to prove the humanity of Christ, assuming his deity.[10]

He goes on to say, "Certainly both ideas appear in both books."[11] If these notions are true, then the Comma is important to John's polemic. Jesus Christ, the human Son of God, is the eternal, living Word (cf. John 1:1).The Word, along with the Father and the Holy Spirit, bears witness to "he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ" (I John 5:6).This assertion would have flown right into the face of Gnosticism.

On the flip side of the coin, the Gnostics would have completely disregarded the truth promulgated in the Johannine Comma. In fact, they may have excised it from the text in the same way that Marcion took a butcher knife to the New Testament in the second century. Also, the Arian heresy, which taught that Jesus was not God but a created being, grew out of Gnosticism. In fact, it was widespread in the Church during the third and fourth centuries. Not long after the Council of Nicea (A.D. 325), an ecumenical council that denounced Arianism, "the whole world woke from a deep slumber and discovered that it had become Arian."[12] Perhaps the prevalent influences of these heresies were responsible for the text falling out of many manuscripts and versions of the New Testament. This hypothesis is at least as plausible as competing theories which suppose that someone added the verses to combat heretical teaching.

4 hours ago ·
IKL The above was taken from part one of

“And These Three Are One”

A Case For the Authenticity of 1st John 5:7-8

Rooted in Biblical Exegesis

BY

JESSE M. BOYD

A very lengthy study on the the supposed "added verses"

4 hours ago · Edited ·
Me \\Even Peter was controlled by Satan as Jesus told Peter get behind me Satan. Many men have had good intentions thinking in there minds they were doing right. \\

Like the KJV translators.
Like Westcott and Hort.

\\Jesus and his word are the same. \\

Yep, and He has preserved His Word in the GREEK MSS that we have. There is no evidence He breathed out the KJV. YOu have blind faith in it, and that's fine, but the problem is that you sin when you call other Bibles tools of the devil and men like James White servants of the devil. It is SIN. You need to REPENT of it.

\\The Mormons bible and The watchtower bible will offend as well. I would not use them either\\

Which destroys the point you were trying to make earlier.

\\I am not saying there isnt enough Gospel in your version to get a person saved \\

Then why say it is a tool of the devil?

\\when we do not read every word of God bibles.\\

What is your evidence that the KJV is that?

\\There is a book God gave us though ...the King James Bible is perfect. 100% accurate.\\

Prove it.

\\The hasty dismissal of this passage in most modern versions of the Bible is largely due to the fact that it is only found in eight of the five hundred Greek manuscripts that witness to the fifth chapter of I John. \\

that's not the problem. The problem is that you are ignorant of the fact that Erasmus actually inserted it in the TR based on false testimony from a friend.
It doesn't belong. The KJV puts it in. The KJV is therefore imperfect.

\\As anyone can clearly see, there is a substantial omission and consequent mix-up of the text.\\

The KJV added to the original Greek. The KJV is wrong.

\\blah blah blah, irrelevant analysis of 1 John\\

That is not evidence that the Comma Johanneum is original.

You keep posting words, but you're not making any argument for the perfection of the KJV, the diabolical nature of other Bibles, or the diabolical service of men like James White.

Therefore, you should STOP SAYING THE NASB, for example, IS A TOOL OF THE DEVIL, AND STOP ACCUSING BRETHREN LIKE JAMES WHITE OF SERVICE TO THE DEVIL.

STOP IT. Repent, IKL. You don't have to talk like a foolish man.

about an hour ago ·
IKL You wont or God has said you cant see the truth. Following the likes of James White will lead you astray. You need to repent of that devils teachings Rho. He has you defending Satan.

about an hour ago ·
Me I don't follow James White.

What devil's teachings? Be specific.
How am I defending Satan? I'm saying the KJV is fantastic and has some small flaws, just like other Bibles.

If you want to say I'm sinning, IKL, love me enough to show me my error. Use real reason and real arguments, not blind faith statements like you have been.

about an hour ago ·
IKL When you deny Gods word as being perfect you are speaking for Satan. James White has spent most of his entire ministry doing that.
It will all be settled one day.
Use your versions and promote them all you will..just dont ever tell me the king James Bible is flawed in one jot or tittle.
That is a memo straight from Satan himself to say such blasphemies it wreaks the uttermost stench of pride arrogance and lies. All Satan is the author of.

about an hour ago · Edited ·
Me \\When you deny Gods word as being perfect\\

I didn't do that, and I already corrected you on that.
Is this the love of Jesus, IKL? To lie about me and/or to refuse even to listen to what I'm saying?

I said, to repeat myself, that there is no evidence that the KJV is perfect or breathed out by God, and in fact there is plenty of evidence that it is NOT perfect. Deal with those facts, please.

\\just dont ever tell me the king James Bible is flawed in one jot or tittle. \\

It added words to the holy Word of God.

\\Use your versions and hold them close j\\

Will you stop posting stuff that says and saying that those other Bibles are tools of the devil? That men like James White are servants of the devil?
If so, great!
If not, BRING FORTH YOUR EVIDENCE.

about an hour ago ·
IKL Satan would love the truth to be stopped. But as long as I have friends relatives coworkers willing to hear I will warn of the counterfeits and share the truth. If that offends you so beit.

about an hour ago ·
Me What is your evidence that they are counterfeits, and that the KJV is perfect?

about an hour ago ·
Me How precisely does the NASB not teach those things that Satan wants not to be taught?
Do you think it doesn't teach the deity of Christ? Depravity of man? Trinity? Resurrection? Reality of devils and angels?
It teaches ALL of these. It teaches the exact same things the KJV teaches, and best of all, I can actually understand what it is saying. You say it's a tool of the devil.

You are SINNING when you say that. Please REPENT of your sin. STOP it.

about an hour ago ·
IKL I have posted many evidences and either you wont or cant see it. It is right there above. I cannot make an intellectual humble enough to see. That is something the individual must do for the holy ghost to open his eyes to see the truth.
You continue with what you feel is correct and I will follow Gods perfect word. When we get to where we are going we will let the judge decide.
All that said I know with what the Holy Ghost has taught and revealed to me that if you speak english there is only one bible. God does not work in confusion. The King James is the bible. All others are mens feeble attempt to correct Gods perfect word.

about an hour ago ·
Me It's not that I won't see them. It's that I have defeated your points and shown them to be either empty or, if consistently applied, applicable to the KJV too.

\\You continue with what you feel is correct and I will follow Gods perfect word. \\

So do that. Will you stop posting stuff that says and saying that those other Bibles are tools of the devil? That men like James White are servants of the devil?
If so, great!
If not, BRING FORTH YOUR EVIDENCE.

\\the Holy Ghost has taught and revealed to me that if you speak english there is only one bible.\\

So it's by blind faith. You don't actually have any evidence for these claims, do you?

IKL, did you know that the Holy Spirit revealed TO ME that the KJV was written by Templars to preserve the divine right of kings, and that God breathed out the CSB?
He DID! I KNOW HE DID. He SPOKE to me.

Prove me wrong.

You can't.
Because appealing to personal experience is NOT THE WAY CHRISTIANITY WORKS. We appeal to JESUS, and we take what HE has said as divine truth. You refuse to deal reasonably with me and appeal to blind faith to justify slandering men of God and good translations.

You are SINNING when you say that. Please REPENT of your sin. STOP it.

about an hour ago ·
IKL Will you stop calling yourself a christian? The same thing as asking me to stop sharing the truth!
Why does this bruise your toes so? I think you know and your pride is getting in the way of you repenting from Calling God a liar.

about an hour ago ·
Me This doesn't bruise me any. The problem here is that YOU ARE SINNING. I love you and I want you to stop sinning and walk in the light.

about an hour ago ·
Me The truth is that the KJV is perfect and the others are tools of the devil and James White is a servant of the devil?
BRING FORTH YOUR EVIDENCE OR STOP SAYING THESE THINGS.

about an hour ago ·
IKL \\The truth is that the KJV is perfect and the others are tools of the devil and James White is a servant of the devil?
BRING FORTH YOUR EVIDENCE OR STOP SAYING THESE THINGS.
Rho the truth often stings kisses of the enemy are deceitful..JW IS DECEITFUL.. He is a puppet of Satan.

59 minutes ago ·
Me \\He is a puppet of Satan.\\

PROVE IT.
He confesses Jesus Christ as Lord, by faith alone. Confesses the Trinity, the resurrection.

You just don't like him b/c he thinks exactly what I think - the KJV is fantastic but has some small flaws.

PROVE YOUR SLANDEROUS CLAIM.

You are sinning, IKL. Stop sinning.

57 minutes ago ·
IKL So does Osteem TD Jakes and a whole host of other false teachers.

53 minutes ago ·
Me Don't act like a fool.
Osteen does not affirm Jesus Christ as Lord.
And Jakes doesn't affirm the Trinity. My, but you're much more ignorant than I took you for.
Sin makes even Christians act stupidly. IKL, please. Repent, brother. Stop sinning against other brethren b/c you have blind faith that the Holy Spirit revealed something to you that is in fact irrational.

51 minutes ago ·
IKL Sorry if he is your favorite teacher Rho. I used to follow him on youtube after I heard him interviewed on a radio show..he said all the right things and seemed right on point..then one day he inadvertently allowed me to see his horns..he began condemning a man I had never heard of..so as i watched a debate from the 80's in which he participated on translations I saw one proof after another and the King James defenders in The debate spoke volumes ..

I looked into Dr Sam Gipp the brother James White often uses as his punching bag and after listening to him I had heard the truth..much that I already knew from the teachings of my pastor and the like but was said so very clearly.
When I spoke to Sam on the phone and told him how I came to hear of him and his books etc..that it was James White who lead me to him ..he just laughed and said yeah he really has it out for me haha. And we spent an hour talking about the counterfeits. I know you called him names in the past as you did Gail and for that I see the abundance of your heart. You should repent and turn, humble yourself so you can see the truth. I say hard things not to make you hate me but because I do care about you Rho.

40 minutes ago ·
Me I don't hate you. I love you enough to tell you that you are sinning when you sin by slander a brother in Christ, James White.
YOU ARE SINNING. Repent and stop it. Be free from this sin!
Sam Gipp makes the same type of illogical and foolish arguments you do. But this isn't about Gipp. It's about how your arguments have utterly failed and you have appealed to some blind faith mystical experience to justify your slandering a brother.

THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL NOT LEAD YOU TO SIN, IKL. You are blaspheming Him when you say that.

Repent, IKL.
Otherwise, bring forth your evidence.

38 minutes ago ·
Me \\ I know you called him names in the past as you did Gail and for that I see the abundance of your heart.\\

I am only too happy to see the abundance of my heart overflow in contempt for those who slander the brethren and calls for them to repent.

36 minutes ago ·
IKL You are defending Satan. Period
Satan will lead you into damnable heresies and doctrines of devils.
I will never be ashamed of Gods perfect word and will never be as foolish as those who defend the counterfeits. My soul depends on it.
When God says that he will remove their names from the lambs book of life ..do you think he is bluffing?

33 minutes ago · Edited ·
Me \\You are defending Satan. Period \\

that is foolishness, and now you're slandering me, a brother in Christ. Do you not hate the evil you're doing right now?

\\Satan will lead you into damnable heresies and doctrines of devils. \\

Of course he will. WHAT EVIDENCE DO YOU HAVE THAT THE NASB IS ONE OF HIS TOOLS?

\\I will never be ashamed of Gods perfect word \\

What is your evidence that the KJV is God's perfect word?

\\When God says they he will remove their names from the lambs book of life ..do you think he is bluffing?\\

He doesn't say He will, for one thing.
And I'm not going to debate you on another topic when you're in sin about this one. You need to repent.

31 minutes ago ·
IKL I have a head like flint Rho so..

As Charles Spurgeon famously said..
We will just have to agree to disagree.

But know this those counterfeits will burn one day. But Gods word will still stand!

27 minutes ago ·
Me We cannot agree as long as you keep sinning against those who love and serve Jesus. You need to repent of your sin.

25 minutes ago

1 comment:

Prince Asbel said...: I notice all the comments are now missing from this picture. I think someone decided their own stellar arguments were too good to leave on the internet for too long... Or something. Yeah. X(; Wed Mar 05, 10:32:00 PM CST