UPDATE, 10 March 2017:
Damon Rambo has made a public statement that looks mostly like repentance, so let's be gracious and give him credit for it. Combined with the fact that he has deleted the posts on his blog to which my own blogposts refer, I am noting the facts here in this update so that all may be informed of the current situation. Note that he has not taken down any comments on other blogs such as Gospel Spam, which probably means he has not done as rigorous and thorough a job of scrubbing his slanderous and wicked comments as I would ask if I had opportunity. Thus, my own posts will remain public and all links will point to Archive.org records of his posts until further notice.
---------------------------
Damon Rambo is certainly doing his part to live out the title of his blog ("The Angry Pastor Blog"). The target of a recent hatchet job based almost entirely on ignorance, hearsay, unrighteous judgment, and poor reading comprehension is Abolish Human Abortion.
Apparently we're "rogue evangelists" and other unsavory labels.
The conversation continues in his combox, but I'll reproduce below the fold the comments so far, minus a string he deleted, which he says he did because they were redundant, which is not true of all of the content, but we can give him the benefit of the doubt if he leaves the other comments unmolested.
I'm
a very active abolitionist and have the full blown approval, support,
guidance, and accountability of godly men, elders, pastors, and fellow
priests all over this country. More important than that, the local
fellowship of which I am a part and active member in good standing
entirely supports the work I do with AHA and adopts the principles of
abolition and practices them as part of our local mission to be salt and
light in the city we live. We are not a Presbyterian church and we
cannot trace the authority of the qualified and teaching men in our
fellowship back to Rome but we do have the same Spirit and Word and seek
to handle it accurately.
You can actually contact and speak with the people you are devouring before you publicly make a fool out of yourself and bear false testimony against brothers. You've been sorely misled Damon Rambo.
You can actually contact and speak with the people you are devouring before you publicly make a fool out of yourself and bear false testimony against brothers. You've been sorely misled Damon Rambo.
The
strawmanning here is very sad. You hate your brothers so much that you
would rather lie about them then bless them. And where did you get
these strawmen? From men who stand to profit off doing the work of
those whom you condemn, who do it for free.
No
straw-manning here. Everything is linked. Anyone who cannot see the
pure satanic attack on the Bride of Christ on the AHA website is blind.
AHA has no authority, yet they claim it. AHA has no power, yet they
assert that they do. The Bride of Christ is God's structure, not
parachurch organizations and anti-church activists. "Men who stand to
make a profit"; funny. AHA's profit DWARFS anything that Marcus and Jon
may have received from their sales (i.e., next to nothing).
Strawmanning; claiming that A//A is not under the authority of the local church.
As the director of the Abolitionist Society of Chicago, I would be more than happy to put you in contact with my pastor (offering the same courtesy Marcus refused when called out about it) so he can explain how much authority we are under.
Or maybe you can talk to the pastors who Marcus claims the first society in Norman are under discipline; I won't be the spreader of gossip here but, if you call that a church with the right to discipline I will pray for your salvation.
Maybe you can talk to all the other directors who talk CONSTANTLY about striving to find a good, Biblical church in their area and have nothing there but watered down, prosperity gospel preaching, heretical, weak churches.
But instead, you say, "AHA is evil because they practice the same exhortation against sin and evil in the church as Paul did".
As the director of the Abolitionist Society of Chicago, I would be more than happy to put you in contact with my pastor (offering the same courtesy Marcus refused when called out about it) so he can explain how much authority we are under.
Or maybe you can talk to the pastors who Marcus claims the first society in Norman are under discipline; I won't be the spreader of gossip here but, if you call that a church with the right to discipline I will pray for your salvation.
Maybe you can talk to all the other directors who talk CONSTANTLY about striving to find a good, Biblical church in their area and have nothing there but watered down, prosperity gospel preaching, heretical, weak churches.
But instead, you say, "AHA is evil because they practice the same exhortation against sin and evil in the church as Paul did".
#1
Paul was an apostle. You are not. #2 The "church" in Norman is NOT a
church. It does not have elders. It does not have membership. It is not a
church. #3 I am not going by what "Marcus said" or anyone else. I am
reading the writing ON YOUR OWN WEBSITE.
You
mean the writing that offers clear directions on determining whether a
church is/isn't a "good church" to begin with (something Marcus agreed
with us from the start) and then if they are just not active or
literally apathetic. The website that offers clear instructions on
offering opportunities for the church to rise up and do their job before
exhorting them?
If only Apostles have the right to exhort people, then you are in sin AS WE SPEAK. But hey, maybe you can answer, since the Norman guys are so wicked; what do you do if there is not one good, Biblical church in your entire city? Forsake the fellowship or start your own?
If only Apostles have the right to exhort people, then you are in sin AS WE SPEAK. But hey, maybe you can answer, since the Norman guys are so wicked; what do you do if there is not one good, Biblical church in your entire city? Forsake the fellowship or start your own?
It
grieves me very much to see this article. Gracious, my dear brother,
did you talk to any abolitionists at all before you wrote it? It
honestly comes across as a hatchet job, not a fair-minded weighing of
the work we're doing and who we are.
May the Lord bless you greatly. I just hate to see it.
May I proceed to reply to a few things?
#1 Paul was an apostle. You are not.
What is your answer to this, please?
http://churchrepent.com/objection-3/
#2 The "church" in Norman is NOT a church. It does not have elders. It does not have membership. It is not a church.
1) There is far more to abolitionism than just that church in Norman.
2) There is more to membership than just paper bylaws. But that church, which I know well, does much more to be in true fellowship and hold each other acctable than any other church I've ever seen.
Plus, it's a young church and they've been pretty busy doing the work of the kingdom to sit down and write out a bunch of bylaws that define membership. Rather, they KNOW who each other are. That's membership. They are truly members of each other.
3) May I please know your argument that biblically speaking, a church is not a church without elders?
I beg your indulgence in this - I wrote about this very objection some months ago. http://rhoblogy.blogspot.com/2013/05/there-is-nothing-that-can-be-done-to.html">The answer is here.
May the Lord bless you greatly. I just hate to see it.
May I proceed to reply to a few things?
#1 Paul was an apostle. You are not.
What is your answer to this, please?
http://churchrepent.com/objection-3/
#2 The "church" in Norman is NOT a church. It does not have elders. It does not have membership. It is not a church.
1) There is far more to abolitionism than just that church in Norman.
2) There is more to membership than just paper bylaws. But that church, which I know well, does much more to be in true fellowship and hold each other acctable than any other church I've ever seen.
Plus, it's a young church and they've been pretty busy doing the work of the kingdom to sit down and write out a bunch of bylaws that define membership. Rather, they KNOW who each other are. That's membership. They are truly members of each other.
3) May I please know your argument that biblically speaking, a church is not a church without elders?
I beg your indulgence in this - I wrote about this very objection some months ago. http://rhoblogy.blogspot.com/2013/05/there-is-nothing-that-can-be-done-to.html">The answer is here.
Grace and peace to you,
Rhology
+Rho Logy
#1 Never do you see the apostle Paul write a letter to the church,
rebuking them for not being actively anti-abortion. Abortion was
prevalent in first century Rome, too, and was very much legal. Paul and
the other writers of the New Testament, list all kinds of particular
ministries, but never is actively opposing the practice of abortion
mentioned. Not to say that we shouldn't do it, or cannot do it. Paul's
exhortation and rebuke to the church's was not about actively opposing
wicked pagan practices. It concerned doctrine (denying the fundamental
tenets of the gospel), and it concerned ungodly practice of the
Christians themselves. I am not aware of a single instance where Paul
writes a Church and says, "Why haven't you opposed Caesar's practices in
this area?" #2 The "church" in Norman is not a church. Bylaws are not
necessary; a defined membership is. When the writers of the epistles
addressed their epistles, they did not address them to "whoever might
come along." They addressed them to specific gatherings of people. 1
Corinthians 5, has Paul telling the Church at Corinth to discipline a
particular person by casting him out of that ASSEMBLY. Since unbelievers
(visitors) were welcome in the weekly assembly, we can easily conclude
that there was a definite membership roll of some kind, whether or not
it was on paper. It was a defined membership. As to the elder issue,
firstly, the "church" at Norman states plainly that it DOES NOT HAVE
ELDERS. This is not just an issue of not appointing your own elders...it
does not have ANY elders, by the testimony of its own website. Nor does
it have deacons. Scripture is clear that you must have elders; every
church had elders appointed to it. The scriptures commands Christians to
follow the elders...anyone who reads the scriptures can see this,
plainly. Notice too, that elders were appointed by other elders and
apostles. You never see, in the scriptures, a person or group of persons
self appointing elders. In baptist churches (I am a Baptist) you have
ordination proceedings where the elders from various churches
investigate your character, your understanding of scripture, your
current ministries, etc., BEFORE you are appointed. Rejection of
authority, like Diotrephes, is a result of pride driven American
individualism, not the Bible.
+Damon Rambo
I truly believe, brother, that our Church Repent site's argumentation
more than answers #1, and in fact if you were to read it with fair eyes,
you would come to understand what so many before us have also
understood, that walking on the other side of the road by the neighbor
being abandoned to the slaughter while on the way to church is not
commendable in the eyes of the Lord Jesus.
As for #2, I await any biblical proof that a church lacking elders is not a church, especially given the arguments I laid forth in my blogpost that I linked previously.
Ditto with a membership on paper.
Ditto with bylaws.
You speak of that of which you are ignorant when you say "whoever might come along". That is NOT how the Door of Hope church in Norman operates. Really, you should check out the other side before making such accusations, for when those who know the truth read them, it makes you look like you have an evil agenda.
Two young men who were unteachable and Pelagian were recently excomm'd from that congregation, which you say is impossible since they don't have membership. The answer is that they DO, in the way that actually matters.
You said this:
\\Scripture is clear that you must have elders; every church had elders appointed to it\\
That is actually not true, and my blogpost, linked before, proves it. I really strongly recommend you check it out.
You said:
\\You never see, in the scriptures, a person or group of persons self appointing elders.\\
Answered in my blogpost.
You said:
\\In baptist churches (I am a Baptist) you have ordination proceedings where the elders from various churches investigate your character\\
All of that started with a man who was self-appointed or appointed by his congregation. There were no Baptists in the modern sense in 600 AD. You don't have an unbroken succession of elders back to the apostles.
I pray you'll think this through very seriously. You're operating according to unbiblical traditions.
You said:
\\The scriptures commands Christians to follow the elders...anyone who reads the scriptures can see this, plainly.\\
Did you know that the church was originally planted with an elder, by an elder, who was sent out by an elder?
Do you know what happened after? If not, may I strongly suggest you find out? Email me at rhology at gmail and I will connect you with those who can recount the history of that. Otherwise, again, you are making false accusations.
Finally,
\\Rejection of authority, like Diotrephes, is a result of pride driven American individualism, not the Bible.\\
Sure, but that's not what's happening here. You'd know that if you'd investigate the matter instead of believing thirdhand slander.
Grace and peace,
Rhology
As for #2, I await any biblical proof that a church lacking elders is not a church, especially given the arguments I laid forth in my blogpost that I linked previously.
Ditto with a membership on paper.
Ditto with bylaws.
You speak of that of which you are ignorant when you say "whoever might come along". That is NOT how the Door of Hope church in Norman operates. Really, you should check out the other side before making such accusations, for when those who know the truth read them, it makes you look like you have an evil agenda.
Two young men who were unteachable and Pelagian were recently excomm'd from that congregation, which you say is impossible since they don't have membership. The answer is that they DO, in the way that actually matters.
You said this:
\\Scripture is clear that you must have elders; every church had elders appointed to it\\
That is actually not true, and my blogpost, linked before, proves it. I really strongly recommend you check it out.
You said:
\\You never see, in the scriptures, a person or group of persons self appointing elders.\\
Answered in my blogpost.
You said:
\\In baptist churches (I am a Baptist) you have ordination proceedings where the elders from various churches investigate your character\\
All of that started with a man who was self-appointed or appointed by his congregation. There were no Baptists in the modern sense in 600 AD. You don't have an unbroken succession of elders back to the apostles.
I pray you'll think this through very seriously. You're operating according to unbiblical traditions.
You said:
\\The scriptures commands Christians to follow the elders...anyone who reads the scriptures can see this, plainly.\\
Did you know that the church was originally planted with an elder, by an elder, who was sent out by an elder?
Do you know what happened after? If not, may I strongly suggest you find out? Email me at rhology at gmail and I will connect you with those who can recount the history of that. Otherwise, again, you are making false accusations.
Finally,
\\Rejection of authority, like Diotrephes, is a result of pride driven American individualism, not the Bible.\\
Sure, but that's not what's happening here. You'd know that if you'd investigate the matter instead of believing thirdhand slander.
Grace and peace,
Rhology
No,
you didn't answer number one. And no, you didn't respond to my post.
Again, abortion was PREVALENT in the first century...nothing about it in
the New Testament. The idea that someone doing exactly what the Bible
calls "pure and undefiled religion" (James 1), namely, ministering to
widows and orphans, is somehow "wrong" because that person is not
involved in your pet ministry, is ridiculous and absurd beyond all
reason. Yes, people are dying in the abortion mill. They are also dying
in the nursing home, they are being dragged out of churches and killed
in other countries...yet its not "REAL" ministry, its not a REAL church,
unless they do what your pharisaical rules say they must. It is absurd.
#2 Question, when people get sick in your church (Norman), what elders
do they call for to pray over the person, in accord with James 5:14? Why
did Titus appoint elders "in EVERY town, if they were optional (Titus
1:5)? Your post smacks of arrogance; i.e., "They don't do things my way,
so I will go rogue." There are at least three Biblical churches in that
area; why reject them? Because the pastors there saw pride and
arrogance in people, and so they had no place in Gospel ministry?
+Damon Rambo \\ abortion was PREVALENT in the first century...nothing about it in the New Testament.\\
http://churchrepent.com/child-sacrifice/
\\The idea that someone doing exactly what the Bible calls "pure and undefiled religion" (James 1), namely, ministering to widows and orphans, is somehow "wrong" because that person is not involved in your pet ministry, is ridiculous\\
1) Nobody has ever said that.
2) The reality is that most professing Christians in this country are simply ignoring all of that in every way.
3) And you seem to be OK with the status quo.
4) The murder of 56 million babies is a "pet ministry". No, that term is much better applied to something like the ladies' doily-knitting ministry for prisons, or to take a better example, the zillions of small groups that get together weekly to discuss a book that only half (at best) of them read during the week and then once they discuss it, they take no action.
May I ask you to check out the argumentation I laid out here?
All On Fire: The Evil of our Age
Abortion is the evil of our age, in fact. I beg you to reconsider, for your own good.
\\They are also dying in the nursing home, they are being dragged out of churches and killed in other countries\\
People are systematically murdering nursing home residents by the million?
Where? When?
\\ Question, when people get sick in your church (Norman), what elders do they call for to pray over the person, in accord with James 5:14?\\
That's not my church, BTW.
I guess you didn't read my above answers. I don't know why I'd continue to talk to you about this; conversation can't progress this way.
Please read what I said above and interact with it.
\\There are at least three Biblical churches in that area; why reject them? \\
You are entirely ignorant of the situation and of the quality of those churches. And you presume to judge your brethren whom you don't know?
\\Because the pastors there saw pride and arrogance in people, and so they had no place in Gospel ministry??\\
Ignorance again.
Please, deal with what I said above. Let's have a conversation; stop ranting at me.
http://churchrepent.com/child-sacrifice/
\\The idea that someone doing exactly what the Bible calls "pure and undefiled religion" (James 1), namely, ministering to widows and orphans, is somehow "wrong" because that person is not involved in your pet ministry, is ridiculous\\
1) Nobody has ever said that.
2) The reality is that most professing Christians in this country are simply ignoring all of that in every way.
3) And you seem to be OK with the status quo.
4) The murder of 56 million babies is a "pet ministry". No, that term is much better applied to something like the ladies' doily-knitting ministry for prisons, or to take a better example, the zillions of small groups that get together weekly to discuss a book that only half (at best) of them read during the week and then once they discuss it, they take no action.
May I ask you to check out the argumentation I laid out here?
All On Fire: The Evil of our Age
Abortion is the evil of our age, in fact. I beg you to reconsider, for your own good.
\\They are also dying in the nursing home, they are being dragged out of churches and killed in other countries\\
People are systematically murdering nursing home residents by the million?
Where? When?
\\ Question, when people get sick in your church (Norman), what elders do they call for to pray over the person, in accord with James 5:14?\\
That's not my church, BTW.
I guess you didn't read my above answers. I don't know why I'd continue to talk to you about this; conversation can't progress this way.
Please read what I said above and interact with it.
\\There are at least three Biblical churches in that area; why reject them? \\
You are entirely ignorant of the situation and of the quality of those churches. And you presume to judge your brethren whom you don't know?
\\Because the pastors there saw pride and arrogance in people, and so they had no place in Gospel ministry??\\
Ignorance again.
Please, deal with what I said above. Let's have a conversation; stop ranting at me.
+Rho Logy
Again, abortion was prevalent in the first century. Again, NOTHING about it in regards to ministry, ever mentioned in the New Testament. The pagans do lots of evil things. Never are we told to take a particular evil thing, and turn that into the end all, be all crusade. //3) And you seem to be OK with the status quo.// You seem to think that God is powerless to provoke His people. Rom_14:4 Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. Again, any proclamation of the Gospel is a strike against abortion.
//4) The murder of 56 million babies is a "pet ministry". No, that term is much better applied to something like the ladies' doily-knitting ministry for prisons, or to take a better example, the zillions of small groups that get together weekly to discuss a book that only half (at best) of them read during the week and then once they discuss it, they take no action.//
So now, not only do you belittle your sisters in Christ, many of them who cannot even get out of the house, who seek to show Christ's love in SOME way (though I am not aware of any "dolie ministry") you also condemn Bible study. So you reject the Word of the Lord, which commands not only a weekly assembly for study and encouragement, but also the constant study of God's Word. NO WONDER you belittle other churches! Your hope and trust is in your own efforts, and not in the Work of God through the Gospel. Repent of your pride, friend.
//All On Fire: The Evil of our Age// Sorry, I am not going to get into an article war on this page. Be pithy, and express your thoughts. I am a busy man.
//Abortion is the evil of our age, in fact. I beg you to reconsider, for your own good//
And I beg YOU to reconsider, for your own good. If you think abortion is the "evil of our age," then I doubt your salvation, friend. The evil of our age is the same in every generation; the rejection of the Lordship and rule of the Lord Jesus Christ. The "evil of our age" is idolatry, the breaking of the first and greatest commandment (according to Jesus; you know, our boss?). You are so Americanized, my friend. You have blinders on, that keep you from seeing the bigger picture. Abortion is horrible; equally horrible are the armies in other countries who are systematically killing people, raping children, and burning churches to the ground. Abortion is horrible; equally horrible was the missionary who was dragged out of the house church in China, placed on the ground with his family watching, and shot in the head.
//People are systematically murdering nursing home residents by the million?
Where? When?// Again, your pride and ignorance are showing. I also notice you (conveniently) ignored the part about people in other countries being pulled out of churches and killed. I guess a widowed woman, laying in a hospital bed by herself, dying without Christ, is no concern to you. I pity you for your lack of compassion.
//That's not my church, BTW.
I guess you didn't read my above answers. I don't know why I'd continue to talk to you about this; conversation can't progress this way.
Please read what I said above and interact with it.// You don't control the conversation on my wall, friend. And I am not going to run around reading articles all day. If your church does have elders, and biblical church structure, I wonder what they think of you claiming that they are unnecessary for a local church? Why on earth would you associate with others who reject such? You are commanded to rebuke a disobedient brother, not defend them!! Again, if I have to defend the necessity of pastors/elders to you, from the New Testament, you have no business being in the ministry, because you do not know your bible.
//You are entirely ignorant of the situation and of the quality of those churches. And you presume to judge your brethren whom you don't know?// No different than what AHA does with their signs. I know there are three 9 marks churches in that area, and I am betting at least one of them are sound. One has to wonder as to the rejection of these churches by at least SOME of the core group of AHA.
\\Ignorance again.
Please, deal with what I said above. Let's have a conversation; stop ranting at me.\\ No ignorance at all. It is SIN for a Christian to not be in a regular weekly assembly, with a Biblical church structure (elders/deacon/membership/discipline). It is ignorance of the scriptures to say otherwise. You, sir, if you are part of a good church, have NO BUSINESS engaging in ministry with those who have rejected the authority of Christ's commands. If you attend a good church, then one can only assume that the reason others do not, is a pride issue; a refusal to recognize Christ ordained authority. A refusal to live in submission to the local assembly. A desire to have one's own way. I have no idea of the personalities involved, or the people. But I KNOW this is the case, because it is the only possible explanation for why people in that area, involved with AHA, do not attend your church (again, assuming you are at a Biblical church). What happened? Was there some kind of falling out? A fight? Someone wanted something a certain way, and an elder refused? Pride, my friend, is ALWAYS the issue with such things. And pride cannot yield fruitful ministry, because it starts from a place of idolatry; a worship of self.
//Bad third hand information// You keep saying things like this. Who do you think I have talked to? Where do you think I am getting "thirdhand" information from? I have not "talked" with anyone. The information came straight from the AHA website, Youtube page, and conversations I have had here and on Facebook with AHA leadership (yes, yes, I know, "we don't have leadership"). I have not gotten "third hand" information from anywhere. I have experience with AHA people who, nearly to a man, reject the necessity and importance of the local church. But that is it. The info comes straight from YOUR websites....if its wrong, change it.
Again, abortion was prevalent in the first century. Again, NOTHING about it in regards to ministry, ever mentioned in the New Testament. The pagans do lots of evil things. Never are we told to take a particular evil thing, and turn that into the end all, be all crusade. //3) And you seem to be OK with the status quo.// You seem to think that God is powerless to provoke His people. Rom_14:4 Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. Again, any proclamation of the Gospel is a strike against abortion.
//4) The murder of 56 million babies is a "pet ministry". No, that term is much better applied to something like the ladies' doily-knitting ministry for prisons, or to take a better example, the zillions of small groups that get together weekly to discuss a book that only half (at best) of them read during the week and then once they discuss it, they take no action.//
So now, not only do you belittle your sisters in Christ, many of them who cannot even get out of the house, who seek to show Christ's love in SOME way (though I am not aware of any "dolie ministry") you also condemn Bible study. So you reject the Word of the Lord, which commands not only a weekly assembly for study and encouragement, but also the constant study of God's Word. NO WONDER you belittle other churches! Your hope and trust is in your own efforts, and not in the Work of God through the Gospel. Repent of your pride, friend.
//All On Fire: The Evil of our Age// Sorry, I am not going to get into an article war on this page. Be pithy, and express your thoughts. I am a busy man.
//Abortion is the evil of our age, in fact. I beg you to reconsider, for your own good//
And I beg YOU to reconsider, for your own good. If you think abortion is the "evil of our age," then I doubt your salvation, friend. The evil of our age is the same in every generation; the rejection of the Lordship and rule of the Lord Jesus Christ. The "evil of our age" is idolatry, the breaking of the first and greatest commandment (according to Jesus; you know, our boss?). You are so Americanized, my friend. You have blinders on, that keep you from seeing the bigger picture. Abortion is horrible; equally horrible are the armies in other countries who are systematically killing people, raping children, and burning churches to the ground. Abortion is horrible; equally horrible was the missionary who was dragged out of the house church in China, placed on the ground with his family watching, and shot in the head.
//People are systematically murdering nursing home residents by the million?
Where? When?// Again, your pride and ignorance are showing. I also notice you (conveniently) ignored the part about people in other countries being pulled out of churches and killed. I guess a widowed woman, laying in a hospital bed by herself, dying without Christ, is no concern to you. I pity you for your lack of compassion.
//That's not my church, BTW.
I guess you didn't read my above answers. I don't know why I'd continue to talk to you about this; conversation can't progress this way.
Please read what I said above and interact with it.// You don't control the conversation on my wall, friend. And I am not going to run around reading articles all day. If your church does have elders, and biblical church structure, I wonder what they think of you claiming that they are unnecessary for a local church? Why on earth would you associate with others who reject such? You are commanded to rebuke a disobedient brother, not defend them!! Again, if I have to defend the necessity of pastors/elders to you, from the New Testament, you have no business being in the ministry, because you do not know your bible.
//You are entirely ignorant of the situation and of the quality of those churches. And you presume to judge your brethren whom you don't know?// No different than what AHA does with their signs. I know there are three 9 marks churches in that area, and I am betting at least one of them are sound. One has to wonder as to the rejection of these churches by at least SOME of the core group of AHA.
\\Ignorance again.
Please, deal with what I said above. Let's have a conversation; stop ranting at me.\\ No ignorance at all. It is SIN for a Christian to not be in a regular weekly assembly, with a Biblical church structure (elders/deacon/membership/discipline). It is ignorance of the scriptures to say otherwise. You, sir, if you are part of a good church, have NO BUSINESS engaging in ministry with those who have rejected the authority of Christ's commands. If you attend a good church, then one can only assume that the reason others do not, is a pride issue; a refusal to recognize Christ ordained authority. A refusal to live in submission to the local assembly. A desire to have one's own way. I have no idea of the personalities involved, or the people. But I KNOW this is the case, because it is the only possible explanation for why people in that area, involved with AHA, do not attend your church (again, assuming you are at a Biblical church). What happened? Was there some kind of falling out? A fight? Someone wanted something a certain way, and an elder refused? Pride, my friend, is ALWAYS the issue with such things. And pride cannot yield fruitful ministry, because it starts from a place of idolatry; a worship of self.
//Bad third hand information// You keep saying things like this. Who do you think I have talked to? Where do you think I am getting "thirdhand" information from? I have not "talked" with anyone. The information came straight from the AHA website, Youtube page, and conversations I have had here and on Facebook with AHA leadership (yes, yes, I know, "we don't have leadership"). I have not gotten "third hand" information from anywhere. I have experience with AHA people who, nearly to a man, reject the necessity and importance of the local church. But that is it. The info comes straight from YOUR websites....if its wrong, change it.
+Damon Rambo \\You seem to think that God is powerless to provoke His people. \\
That's incorrect.
God uses means to do so.
http://www.abolitionism.tv/videos/87/a-biblical-blueprint-for-exhortation-by-rhology
\\not only do you belittle your sisters in Christ, many of them who cannot even get out of the house\\
I have belittled nobody.
Rather, YOU are the one belittling me and other abolitionists with your unrepentant and unbecoming of a pastor ignorant accusations.
You ought to repent of this behavior.
\\you also condemn Bible study\\
The fair-minded reader will note I did nothing of the kind.
\\Sorry, I am not going to get into an article war on this page. Be pithy, and express your thoughts. I am a busy man.\\
Not too busy to spend many lines belittling and speaking sinfully to someone you don't know about hundreds you don't know.
Let the fair-minded reader check out the links.
\\If you think abortion is the "evil of our age," then I doubt your salvation, friend.\\
Given the discernment you've displayed here and the level of spiritual maturity you've evinced, that is actually a somewhat comforting thought to me.
\\The evil of our age is the same in every generation; the rejection of the Lordship and rule of the Lord Jesus Christ. \\
The linked-to talk interacts with that contention.
\\ Abortion is horrible; equally horrible are the armies in other countries who are systematically killing people\\
1) Apparently, unkempt lawns are also equally horrible in your eyes.
2) Got any proposals how I can do something to fight against those armies? No? Yeah, didn't think so. But what I can do is wield the Gospel against this great evil in my own nation.
\\Abortion is horrible; equally horrible was the missionary who was dragged out of the house church in China, placed on the ground with his family watching, and shot in the head.\\
Really?
One murder is equal in horror to 56 million?
I'd like to see how you make that argument.
\\I guess a widowed woman, laying in a hospital bed by herself, dying without Christ, is no concern to you. \\
????
\\ If your church does have elders, and biblical church structure, I wonder what they think of you claiming that they are unnecessary for a local church?\\
I didn't say they are unnecessary. You're a very unfair person, sir.
I said the absence of elders does not render a church non-existent. And I gave numerous biblical examples, which you clearly didn't care to read.
\\You are commanded to rebuke a disobedient brother, not defend them!\\
Unless they're apathetic about abortion, right?
\\I know there are three 9 marks churches in that area\\
And?
Nazi Germany was full of biblical, orthodox churches while Hitler was rising to power and dehumanising Jews.
\\One has to wonder as to the rejection of these churches by at least SOME of the core group of AHA.\\
One wouldn't have to wonder if one did one's due diligence and approached brethren with his concerns before attempting to sow discord and division with an ill-advised and ignorant rant on his blog.
\\A refusal to live in submission to the local assembly\\
?
Where in the SCripture does it talk about being in submission to the LOCAL ASSEMBLY?
Do you mean the elders? What does that mean, biblically speaking?
What does this passage mean?
Luke 22:24And there arose also a dispute among them as to which one of them was regarded to be greatest. 25And He said to them, “The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them; and those who have authority over them are called ‘Benefactors.’ 26“But it is not this way with you, but the one who is the greatest among you must become like the youngest, and the leader like the servant. 27“For who is greater, the one who reclines at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who reclines at the table? But I am among you as the one who serves.
\\But I KNOW this is the case, because it is the only possible explanation for why people in that area, involved with AHA, do not attend your church (again, assuming you are at a Biblical church). What happened? Was there some kind of falling out? A fight?\\
So you don't know.
That's right; of course you don't know.
Yet even now, even after all of your offensive, judgmental, evil words, I'd be happy to explain it to you.
Would you email me?
\\I have not "talked" with anyone. The information came straight from the AHA website\\
Then you literally know nothing about the situation, yet that has not stopped you from ranting and spewing evil words about brethren, without knowledge.
You ought to repent of this. I'm still happy to talk to you. Repent, for your own good, and we can.
\\I have experience with AHA people who, nearly to a man, reject the necessity and importance of the local church\\
Who?
What does "reject the necessity and importance of the local church" mean? Does it mean they love the church enough to warn her that she is in sin?
That's incorrect.
God uses means to do so.
http://www.abolitionism.tv/videos/87/a-biblical-blueprint-for-exhortation-by-rhology
\\not only do you belittle your sisters in Christ, many of them who cannot even get out of the house\\
I have belittled nobody.
Rather, YOU are the one belittling me and other abolitionists with your unrepentant and unbecoming of a pastor ignorant accusations.
You ought to repent of this behavior.
\\you also condemn Bible study\\
The fair-minded reader will note I did nothing of the kind.
\\Sorry, I am not going to get into an article war on this page. Be pithy, and express your thoughts. I am a busy man.\\
Not too busy to spend many lines belittling and speaking sinfully to someone you don't know about hundreds you don't know.
Let the fair-minded reader check out the links.
\\If you think abortion is the "evil of our age," then I doubt your salvation, friend.\\
Given the discernment you've displayed here and the level of spiritual maturity you've evinced, that is actually a somewhat comforting thought to me.
\\The evil of our age is the same in every generation; the rejection of the Lordship and rule of the Lord Jesus Christ. \\
The linked-to talk interacts with that contention.
\\ Abortion is horrible; equally horrible are the armies in other countries who are systematically killing people\\
1) Apparently, unkempt lawns are also equally horrible in your eyes.
2) Got any proposals how I can do something to fight against those armies? No? Yeah, didn't think so. But what I can do is wield the Gospel against this great evil in my own nation.
\\Abortion is horrible; equally horrible was the missionary who was dragged out of the house church in China, placed on the ground with his family watching, and shot in the head.\\
Really?
One murder is equal in horror to 56 million?
I'd like to see how you make that argument.
\\I guess a widowed woman, laying in a hospital bed by herself, dying without Christ, is no concern to you. \\
????
\\ If your church does have elders, and biblical church structure, I wonder what they think of you claiming that they are unnecessary for a local church?\\
I didn't say they are unnecessary. You're a very unfair person, sir.
I said the absence of elders does not render a church non-existent. And I gave numerous biblical examples, which you clearly didn't care to read.
\\You are commanded to rebuke a disobedient brother, not defend them!\\
Unless they're apathetic about abortion, right?
\\I know there are three 9 marks churches in that area\\
And?
Nazi Germany was full of biblical, orthodox churches while Hitler was rising to power and dehumanising Jews.
\\One has to wonder as to the rejection of these churches by at least SOME of the core group of AHA.\\
One wouldn't have to wonder if one did one's due diligence and approached brethren with his concerns before attempting to sow discord and division with an ill-advised and ignorant rant on his blog.
\\A refusal to live in submission to the local assembly\\
?
Where in the SCripture does it talk about being in submission to the LOCAL ASSEMBLY?
Do you mean the elders? What does that mean, biblically speaking?
What does this passage mean?
Luke 22:24And there arose also a dispute among them as to which one of them was regarded to be greatest. 25And He said to them, “The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them; and those who have authority over them are called ‘Benefactors.’ 26“But it is not this way with you, but the one who is the greatest among you must become like the youngest, and the leader like the servant. 27“For who is greater, the one who reclines at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who reclines at the table? But I am among you as the one who serves.
\\But I KNOW this is the case, because it is the only possible explanation for why people in that area, involved with AHA, do not attend your church (again, assuming you are at a Biblical church). What happened? Was there some kind of falling out? A fight?\\
So you don't know.
That's right; of course you don't know.
Yet even now, even after all of your offensive, judgmental, evil words, I'd be happy to explain it to you.
Would you email me?
\\I have not "talked" with anyone. The information came straight from the AHA website\\
Then you literally know nothing about the situation, yet that has not stopped you from ranting and spewing evil words about brethren, without knowledge.
You ought to repent of this. I'm still happy to talk to you. Repent, for your own good, and we can.
\\I have experience with AHA people who, nearly to a man, reject the necessity and importance of the local church\\
Who?
What does "reject the necessity and importance of the local church" mean? Does it mean they love the church enough to warn her that she is in sin?
+Rho Logy //That's incorrect.
God uses means to do so.// Right. And His means are the elders and others in that local church holding each other accountable. Its not holding up signs, calling people to repent of imaginary sins.
//I have belittled nobody.
Rather, YOU are the one belittling me and other abolitionists with your unrepentant and unbecoming of a pastor ignorant accusations.
You ought to repent of this behavior.//
Nothing to repent of. The proof is on your own websites. The "unbecoming behavior" is that of Mr. Hunter and the others of AHA who reject legitimate church accountability and leadership. Do you not understand the division that they cause? It is PRIDE, my friend. If he REALLY cared about the abortion issue, as he claims to, he would find a legitimate church and join it post haste. He would do it, EVEN if he thought it wasn't necessary (which, anyone who believes it isn't is biblically illiterate, but that is another matter). The fact? He doesn't care. Or at least, his pride is more important than his cause.
//\\The evil of our age is the same in every generation; the rejection of the Lordship and rule of the Lord Jesus Christ. \\ Reposting this. There is no denying it.
//One wouldn't have to wonder if one did one's due diligence and approached brethren with his concerns before attempting to sow discord and division with an ill-advised and ignorant rant on his blog.//
Don't blame ME, if the information on YOUR websites, and Youtube page is inaccurate. The people who are "sowing discord" are the ones who are attacking local churches, and refusing biblical authority. Division could easily be healed, if AHA would repent of their display of contempt for Christ's Bride, and His ordained ministry structure.
//Unless they're apathetic about abortion, right?// Not doing as much as you think they should, or in a way that you think is appropriate, is not sin. Nor is engaging in a ministry other than abortion ministry, INSTEAD of abortion ministry. A person taking Bible's to China, or ministering at the Nursing home, is not sinning because they are not directly involved in the abortion issue. That is absolute Biblical ignorance.
//Where in the Scripture does it talk about being in submission to the LOCAL ASSEMBLY?// 1Pe 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
Heb 13:17 Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.
//Really?
One murder is equal in horror to 56 million?
I'd like to see how you make that argument.// Yes, equally horrible. Seeing as how its not just the one man, but millions of people dying, killed, raped, etc. You are being silly.
//Then you literally know nothing about the situation, yet that has not stopped you from ranting and spewing evil words about brethren, without knowledge.
You ought to repent of this. I'm still happy to talk to you. Repent, for your own good, and we can.// Wow. So I am not allowed to critique your website, and the information contained therein?
My friend, I have further investigated Mr. Hunter, and am even MORE convinced of his pride. He says of a brother in Christ, "I am so sick of that little capitalist." (Speaking of Marcus Pittman of Crown Rights Media). Also other Stuff that I will not repeat!
God uses means to do so.// Right. And His means are the elders and others in that local church holding each other accountable. Its not holding up signs, calling people to repent of imaginary sins.
//I have belittled nobody.
Rather, YOU are the one belittling me and other abolitionists with your unrepentant and unbecoming of a pastor ignorant accusations.
You ought to repent of this behavior.//
Nothing to repent of. The proof is on your own websites. The "unbecoming behavior" is that of Mr. Hunter and the others of AHA who reject legitimate church accountability and leadership. Do you not understand the division that they cause? It is PRIDE, my friend. If he REALLY cared about the abortion issue, as he claims to, he would find a legitimate church and join it post haste. He would do it, EVEN if he thought it wasn't necessary (which, anyone who believes it isn't is biblically illiterate, but that is another matter). The fact? He doesn't care. Or at least, his pride is more important than his cause.
//\\The evil of our age is the same in every generation; the rejection of the Lordship and rule of the Lord Jesus Christ. \\ Reposting this. There is no denying it.
//One wouldn't have to wonder if one did one's due diligence and approached brethren with his concerns before attempting to sow discord and division with an ill-advised and ignorant rant on his blog.//
Don't blame ME, if the information on YOUR websites, and Youtube page is inaccurate. The people who are "sowing discord" are the ones who are attacking local churches, and refusing biblical authority. Division could easily be healed, if AHA would repent of their display of contempt for Christ's Bride, and His ordained ministry structure.
//Unless they're apathetic about abortion, right?// Not doing as much as you think they should, or in a way that you think is appropriate, is not sin. Nor is engaging in a ministry other than abortion ministry, INSTEAD of abortion ministry. A person taking Bible's to China, or ministering at the Nursing home, is not sinning because they are not directly involved in the abortion issue. That is absolute Biblical ignorance.
//Where in the Scripture does it talk about being in submission to the LOCAL ASSEMBLY?// 1Pe 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
Heb 13:17 Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.
//Really?
One murder is equal in horror to 56 million?
I'd like to see how you make that argument.// Yes, equally horrible. Seeing as how its not just the one man, but millions of people dying, killed, raped, etc. You are being silly.
//Then you literally know nothing about the situation, yet that has not stopped you from ranting and spewing evil words about brethren, without knowledge.
You ought to repent of this. I'm still happy to talk to you. Repent, for your own good, and we can.// Wow. So I am not allowed to critique your website, and the information contained therein?
My friend, I have further investigated Mr. Hunter, and am even MORE convinced of his pride. He says of a brother in Christ, "I am so sick of that little capitalist." (Speaking of Marcus Pittman of Crown Rights Media). Also other Stuff that I will not repeat!
+Damon Rambo
\\His means are the elders and others in that local church holding each other accountable. Its not holding up signs, calling people to repent of imaginary sins.\\
Those are supposed to be the means, yes. Show me in Scripture that's a limitation or some sort of border. Rather, it's a RESPONSIBILITY. THe people in churches are supposed to be doing that. When they're not, a Christian outside that church can either ignore their sin or step in with love and try to show his brother his sin, regardless of whether they are part of the same visible local church. We do that out of love, your vigorous, ignorant, and wrong-headed protestations to the contrary notwithstanding. You don't know any of us, so you're in no position to judge with righteous judgment.
Also, apathy is not an imaginary sin. I'm glad that you seem never to have encountered apathy in your church, or maybe you just don't care that apathy is all around you b/c you are apathetic as well.
\\Nothing to repent of. The proof is on your own websites.\\
Where? Be specific, please.
\\Mr. Hunter and the others of AHA who reject legitimate church accountability and leadership\\
That is false, and you'd know that if you'd talk to us instead of leading with a hatchet job.
\\Do you not understand the division that they cause? It is PRIDE, my friend.\\
You mean the division we EXPOSE? Between those who truly love to serve Jesus and those who love only to name the name in vain?
If you knew us, you'd know it's not pride, yet may God protect us all from pride! We are actually sorrowful that the church in America is in such shambles, but out of love and repentance for our own past and present apathy we seek to live faithfully for Jesus and provoke others to do the same.
\\ If he REALLY cared about the abortion issue, as he claims to, he would find a legitimate church\\
He did, and he has.
You still haven't proven from the Bible that lack of elders FOR NOW = no church,and you haven't interacted with my counterexamples.
We both know it's b/c you can't do so, but you seem to love your traditions in this area more than the biblical teaching.
\\The people who are "sowing discord" are the ones who are attacking local churches,\\
Calling a person to repentance out of love is not an attack. You ought to know this, as a pastor. But you don't seem to want to be fair.
\\contempt for Christ's Bride\\
For the fourth time, that is not true. But you seem not to care too much about the truth.
\\ 1Pe 5:5 and Heb 13:17\\
Sorry, where was the word or concept "authority of the church" in there?
If you mean to the elder, then say "authority of the elder", and then we can talk about what that means. Don't say "authority of the church" and then quote a verse about the elder when asked to substantiate your contention biblically.
Is that how you teach your flock to exegete the Scripture? Yikes.
\\Yes, equally horrible.\\
So one death is equally horrible to 56 million deaths.
OK then.
\\So I am not allowed to critique your website, and the information contained therein?\\
I have not said that. Again you show yourself to be unfair.
I pointed out that you have made several judgments about our behavior yet you don't know any of us. I suggest you ask us about these things and then you make this gripe?
\\He says of a brother in Christ, "I am so sick of that little capitalist." (Speaking of Marcus Pittman of Crown Rights Media)\\
Perhaps you should ask Mr Hunter why he said that. If you had any idea how Pittman has acted toward us, and if you cared about truth, you'd understand. And what evidence do you have that Pittman is a brother in Christ? He has not acted that way toward us.
\\Also other Stuff that I will not repeat!\\
LOL thus you imply Hunter uses profanity or something.
I pray you will repent, seriously. I am praying for you.
\\His means are the elders and others in that local church holding each other accountable. Its not holding up signs, calling people to repent of imaginary sins.\\
Those are supposed to be the means, yes. Show me in Scripture that's a limitation or some sort of border. Rather, it's a RESPONSIBILITY. THe people in churches are supposed to be doing that. When they're not, a Christian outside that church can either ignore their sin or step in with love and try to show his brother his sin, regardless of whether they are part of the same visible local church. We do that out of love, your vigorous, ignorant, and wrong-headed protestations to the contrary notwithstanding. You don't know any of us, so you're in no position to judge with righteous judgment.
Also, apathy is not an imaginary sin. I'm glad that you seem never to have encountered apathy in your church, or maybe you just don't care that apathy is all around you b/c you are apathetic as well.
\\Nothing to repent of. The proof is on your own websites.\\
Where? Be specific, please.
\\Mr. Hunter and the others of AHA who reject legitimate church accountability and leadership\\
That is false, and you'd know that if you'd talk to us instead of leading with a hatchet job.
\\Do you not understand the division that they cause? It is PRIDE, my friend.\\
You mean the division we EXPOSE? Between those who truly love to serve Jesus and those who love only to name the name in vain?
If you knew us, you'd know it's not pride, yet may God protect us all from pride! We are actually sorrowful that the church in America is in such shambles, but out of love and repentance for our own past and present apathy we seek to live faithfully for Jesus and provoke others to do the same.
\\ If he REALLY cared about the abortion issue, as he claims to, he would find a legitimate church\\
He did, and he has.
You still haven't proven from the Bible that lack of elders FOR NOW = no church,and you haven't interacted with my counterexamples.
We both know it's b/c you can't do so, but you seem to love your traditions in this area more than the biblical teaching.
\\The people who are "sowing discord" are the ones who are attacking local churches,\\
Calling a person to repentance out of love is not an attack. You ought to know this, as a pastor. But you don't seem to want to be fair.
\\contempt for Christ's Bride\\
For the fourth time, that is not true. But you seem not to care too much about the truth.
\\ 1Pe 5:5 and Heb 13:17\\
Sorry, where was the word or concept "authority of the church" in there?
If you mean to the elder, then say "authority of the elder", and then we can talk about what that means. Don't say "authority of the church" and then quote a verse about the elder when asked to substantiate your contention biblically.
Is that how you teach your flock to exegete the Scripture? Yikes.
\\Yes, equally horrible.\\
So one death is equally horrible to 56 million deaths.
OK then.
\\So I am not allowed to critique your website, and the information contained therein?\\
I have not said that. Again you show yourself to be unfair.
I pointed out that you have made several judgments about our behavior yet you don't know any of us. I suggest you ask us about these things and then you make this gripe?
\\He says of a brother in Christ, "I am so sick of that little capitalist." (Speaking of Marcus Pittman of Crown Rights Media)\\
Perhaps you should ask Mr Hunter why he said that. If you had any idea how Pittman has acted toward us, and if you cared about truth, you'd understand. And what evidence do you have that Pittman is a brother in Christ? He has not acted that way toward us.
\\Also other Stuff that I will not repeat!\\
LOL thus you imply Hunter uses profanity or something.
I pray you will repent, seriously. I am praying for you.
+Rhology
Mr. Rhology, I have been more than fair. You continually disparage a
brother in Christ (Though I don't know Marcus Pittman, or the
circumstances surrounding AHA and their falling out, I DO know Jon
Speed, who is a godly, dedicated brother in Christ, and would not be
involved with someone who wasn't), deny the clear necessity of elders in
a church, assert that Mr. Hunter is in a "church" when HIS OWN WEBSITE
says they do not have elders, do not have deacons, and do not have a
membership. You attack other churches for not being involved in a
ministry the way you want them to, without biblical warrant. I am done
speaking with you. Readers can go the links posted, and judge for
themselves. I will be posting screen shots of Mr. Hunters wall, that I
took, later this week so that people can see just how "dishonest" I have
been (even his AHA friends called him out for what he said). Take your
anti-Church garbage somewhere else, sir, since you cannot talk civilly.
I'm not surprised to hear you know and like Speed. You act just like him. That's not a compliment.
\\deny the clear necessity of elders in a church,\\
So does the New Testament. But you've already shown you don't care about that.
\\assert that Mr. Hunter is in a "church" when HIS OWN WEBSITE says they do not have elders\\
I still await your biblical argument that no elders for a time = not a church, and the overthrow of my biblical counterexamples.
Surely that has to matter to you? The fact that you've presented nothing but assertions and ignored biblical evidence?
\\do not have a membership\\
We already talked about that, and your position amounts to "they need bylaws written on paper". You couldn't be more wrong.
\\You attack other churches\\
For the fourth time, calling people to repent out of love is not an attack.
\\I am done speaking with you. Readers can go the links posted, and judge for themselves\\
You never talked WITH me. You talked AT me.
Yes, let the reader judge. I hope, for your congregation's own good, many will read this exchange and realise the kind of man you are.
\\Take your anti-Church garbage somewhere else, sir, since you cannot talk civilly.?\\
I am left speechless at your words, sir.
\\deny the clear necessity of elders in a church,\\
So does the New Testament. But you've already shown you don't care about that.
\\assert that Mr. Hunter is in a "church" when HIS OWN WEBSITE says they do not have elders\\
I still await your biblical argument that no elders for a time = not a church, and the overthrow of my biblical counterexamples.
Surely that has to matter to you? The fact that you've presented nothing but assertions and ignored biblical evidence?
\\do not have a membership\\
We already talked about that, and your position amounts to "they need bylaws written on paper". You couldn't be more wrong.
\\You attack other churches\\
For the fourth time, calling people to repent out of love is not an attack.
\\I am done speaking with you. Readers can go the links posted, and judge for themselves\\
You never talked WITH me. You talked AT me.
Yes, let the reader judge. I hope, for your congregation's own good, many will read this exchange and realise the kind of man you are.
\\Take your anti-Church garbage somewhere else, sir, since you cannot talk civilly.?\\
I am left speechless at your words, sir.
+Rhology
Again, I am done here. Jon Speed is a godly man. My congregation has
met him, and would agree. Your attacks against him won't win you any
friends here, sir. Nor will your attacks against the church.
+Rhology
Again, Mr. Rhology, I am not going to tolerate disparaging remarks
against brothers in Christ on this site. Do your elders at your know of your extra-curricular activities? I cannot
believe that elders would support your behavior here.
(At this point, Rambo deleted the comment above in which I addressed Jon Speed's character.)
+Damon Rambo
So you're deleting comments. I knew it would come to this.
Yes, of course they know. And they are wise enough to understand what you fail to realise despite numerous corrections - that calls to repentance are not the same as attacks. It's not even an argument. You're acting like a foolish man. Unbecoming of a pastor.
So you're deleting comments. I knew it would come to this.
Yes, of course they know. And they are wise enough to understand what you fail to realise despite numerous corrections - that calls to repentance are not the same as attacks. It's not even an argument. You're acting like a foolish man. Unbecoming of a pastor.
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